[Off Topic] - Why Is A.I. Generated Content Like Music & Images Looked Down Upon In Video Games?

[gobbel]

This is a little bit of a “you criticize society, yet you live in society” type argument. As you are clearly very aware, just about every marot tech company in the world uses AI in one form or another. We are mad at them, it’s just, we don’t have the billions of dollars it would take to do anything about them.

@OffByThree

It doesn’t read as a line being drawn for ethics as much as it is aesthetic.

But at the same time, outrage directed at solo devs, small creators and the like who use AI products is the one thing we can actually do to affect some change (obviously not talking about people who are forced to use those tools to make a living, but people like OP up top). We can’t stop Google, but we can at the very least reject the use of AI in our own circles, and that is still worth something. It’s the only power we have.

I reject entirely the notion that by using YouTube or Godot Forums, we are somehow meaningfully supporting these platforms. If you want to change people’s minds, you have to talk to them, and to do that you have to go where they are. It’s about cultural movements, not how many cents you’ve personally added to Meta’s dragon hoard. The worth of those companies is tied up in speculative investment anyway, if our “support” mattered to them they would lose money when the economy loses money, not multiply their worth.

I think youre basically just trying to get a pass to cross the picket line.

[athousandships]

I think this is a very important point: the big industry isn’t us, and we’re not them, they are able to do things we can’t, and vice versa, just because they do things doesn’t mean we have to, and us using certain things, AI or otherwise, can have an impact on our fellow devs that the big companies doing so just doesn’t

The big studios don’t tell a lot of stories we can for example, games that represent groups that would never get a AAA game because there’s no profit for them in it (or so they tell themselves)

Does that mean we should give up on telling those stories? Or using those odd new ideas that the big studios would never do because it’s too risky?

We have a responsibility to one another, or we’ll find ourselves with no one else around because everyone had to stop doing indie dev because they couldn’t pay the bills, even if you’d never pay an artist for art you’d still be affected by a big part of the artists in the open source and indie world becoming homeless or having to get a 9-5 job instead of doing what they love

(Also, there’s no guarantee that the big studios using AI won’t hurt them massively, the technology is nowhere near replacing humans and them replacing artists and programmers and designers can easily crash their whole situation, especially if they alienate their workers)

[thesnesmaster]

Honestly the AI problems are far more bad than just “the environment”, jobs, etc..
Either way, as long as some company wants to make advanced tech,
a “Midgar” scenario is already inevitable.

As for the whole AI being unethical, it literally sounds to me like buying a tool or using a free tool makes people lose their jobs. I am not saying i dont care, i am saying that looking at the full chessboard, i can see no good moves to be made, the small amount we can contribute to is not enough, eventually i feel like AI will replace almost all indie dev (and i am not exited about)

This AI thing is a lost cause, only reason i would say not to use AI is the backlash you see before you. I would more so be worried about Gen Alpha being raised with AI, the more they get used to it, the worse the future becomes.

[athousandships]

Ultimately we also have to recognize that there are levels of impact, and scope

For example, does it really change anything measurably about climate change if you drive your car to work instead of taking public transport when you are able? Not really. But does it affect other things tangibly? Yes! Does you not driving a car today mean less local pollution, less air particulates from your tires, less noise pollution, less congestion? Yes!

Does your choice to use or not use AI affect the industry at large? Not necessarily, not without organized action. But does you choosing to make a game with AI art instead of paying a real artist real money have a real impact on real people and their lives (or for that matter free art, which when presented voluntarily has real value for visibility for artists)? Yes! AI won’t solve a world where all indie artists have stopped making art because they can’t live off it any longer

Just like you choosing to not bother to drop the trash in the bin doesn’t really put a dent in ocean pollution etc., it does have the potential for real, tangible impact in the world around you. If you chose not to throw that gum on the pavement and instead put it in the bin or in the wrapping a bird might not get injured today (and perhaps that gum ends up on the street anyway because someone searches through the bin, but you did your part to try to prevent that)

[Frozen_Fried]

It should land on everyone who uses A.I to create entire programs or art. Games weren’t meant to be made in just a few days. We can compare LLMs to a juicer.it just blends everything it finds on the internet.so when you give commands to it,it blend whatever it finds on the internet like watery code, solid code, Chessy ideas it just blends everything. Thus, how we get Slops

Definition of Slop:
food waste (such as garbage) that is used to feed animals,
thin tasteless drink or liquid food—usually used in plural

So, now since we know the definition of A.I slop let’s move on!

The danger of using A.I

When you start to make a game using A.I, it goes well for first few days. But when the project grows (Likey mid-level progress_) you’ll get cooked! I saw some people who doesn’t even know how to solve the SIMPLEST thing in entire Godot meanwhile the code s/he shows is what a Godot regular would code.

Risk of using A.I

Okay! Great, you made your A.I slop assisted game and it got a goood fan-base!
Now they want guess what? Updates! soo you start to add new things but ohh no! you remember nothing! because everything was coded by a juicer!

Spilling is simple, Undoing is not - Wise Guy

I remember a guy who made I guess a multiplayer game using A.I? and people like me kept nuking the servers and database.

We don’t care about A.I generated art - Yes, game is an art

We don’t care if there’s an A.I generated laying around. But we do care if we can’t doom scroll peacefully, show our work but it gets buried under 1000s of A.I slop, Another dev near a data center is starving because the power has been out for 10 days. Now we have to pick up our Weapons!

Since game development is art,don’t forget the defenition of art!

Art is the conscious use of human skill, imagination, and creativity to produce > works that communicate ideas, emotions, or aesthetic beauty

Thanks for reading! it’s a lonngg post! Sorry for grammar and spelling mistakes.

[athousandships]

AI art is also used for a lot of unethical things that are IMO far more inherent to the medium than it is for other artforms simply because it’s a machine that takes commands

AI art is used for misinformation, and targeted abuse of people, and children (I’ll leave it at that, too dark and offensive a topic to elaborate on here, but I think it’s not unknown to most people)

While it’s possible to separate the different uses it’s not the same as “well you can use photoshop to make fakes” when you can just ask it to create an image of some politician doing something horrible and you get it a moment later, and we at least need to acknowledge those uses when talking about the issues of these tools

[Frozen_Fried]

This was my longest post! now lemme get in my old form.

A.I is the future!!!
The future:

Guys! Cuphead DLSS leaked!

[athousandships]

It’s also important to be aware of that AI strongly reinforces and consistently regurgitates our existing social norms and hierarchies, as well as stereotypes. Using AI tools to make art without being aware of the ways it does so and the patterns it uses is very harmful, especially lacking critical awareness of these issues. For example racist stereotypes about the appearance of different groups

That’s not to say that human artists are magically spared this, but AI tools don’t think for themselves, and having just you as part of the equation puts extra onus on you to be aware of this and makes you entirely responsible for this. The prompt format also makes it far more susceptible to the specific ways you express yourself and how it “interprets” what you say, in ways that a human artist generally isn’t

AI art is just a merger of all the art it consumed to train, so it is colored by the biases and ideas of those who created those references. If a lot of artists doing certain art styles draw Black people with certain traits then it will too, and it might be difficult or impossible to make it not do that. If you hire a racist to make your art then you’re responsible for that, if you use AI you are responsible for the things it carries with it based on that data

[iOSxcOder]

@athousandships

AI art is just a merger of all the art it consumed to train, so it is colored by the biases and ideas of those who created those references. If a lot of artists doing certain art styles draw Black people with certain traits then it will too, and it might be difficult or impossible to make it not do that. If you hire a racist to make your art then you’re responsible for that, if you use AI you are responsible for the things it carries with it based on that data

It is impossible to know what data was used to train as this information not coming along with it .

[screen-pixl-4096]

@savantsavior

We opted to use A.I. generated music and images

real godot pros use binary coding to create images and music, get with the times old man B)

[iOSxcOder]

Binary for music ? How does it works ? Like mean format , codec , compression

[athousandships]

Chiptunes perhaps!

[iOSxcOder]

Is that not 8-bit midi ?

[athousandships]

Not MIDI as such but it’s command based so in a sense yes

[screen-pixl-4096]

godot pros make a blank mp4 file and edit the binary to make music. only the godot pros understand

[boe_taito]

That’s amateur work; real pros use a magnetized needle and a steady hand.

[thesnesmaster]

The ultimate melodies are OGGs consisting of tapping toothpicks and editing in audacity.

[iOSxcOder]

mp4 is this have visual effects right

[thesnesmaster]

wanna say Its called “seeing sound” correct?

[iOSxcOder]

Waveforms or visualisation ( Winamp ) maybe along with sound , m4a exist but mp4 for sound that’s something .mov hevc