The Immense Engine - An LLM Godot Competitor?

I read this article today: Can a European game engine compete with Godot?

It was pretty interesting. But apparently this engine is LLM-powered? And I cannot find a website for it, or any proof that it actually exists other than news articles saying it exists.

I don’t think it’s going to be much of a competitor to Unity, Unreal or Godot though.

Although I was wondering this morning if in a decade would programming be considered more of an art than a science? Will creating software with AI of some sort become the standard? With only bespoke software and hobbyist software existing? Like pottery and woodworking at a farmer’s market?

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I’m sure this is very different for others, but I enjoy game development specifically because it’s full of interesting problems to solve, and you can approach said problems in so many creative ways.

Taking away the problem solving aspect and outsourcing it to an LLM takes away all the fun I had with it, so I really hope the future won’t be LLM-only or LLM-first game engines.

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Ignoring the fact that it takes 10-20 years of work to make a competent game engine, it’s also “LLM powered” (whatever that means).

So, it’s using an unproven and unreliable piece of tech for something as creative as game design or as deterministic as programming.

What a joke. This would be a type of move Redot would make. And I mean that in the worst way possible.

Also, “compete” is a strong word and is against Godot’s open-source philosophy.

If someone wanted, they could fork Godot to make an AI slop version. Someone already tried that and look how that went:

Blured Engine - Godot 4.x fork with built-in AI server, build games fully with natural language

Also, AI is stupidly expensive. It’s only free from the major players because they’re trying to get the market before the bubble pops, reality sets in, and they either jack up the price or shut down. That’s already happened to Sora.

The person using this “AI game engine” will have to pay to simply program. While Godot works on your phone and is extremely accessible for low-income folks.

Godot is for the good of the entire game industry, and should work with others, not compete with them. The cooperation is the reason we’re all here in this thread right now.

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Vaporware.

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In an interview with Dutch podcast De Technoloog, Brussee explained that popular engines today restrict creators due to the way they are structured.

As reported by VGC, they are “made for and by people who have to click through a menu with a mouse”, and while engines like Unreal have a respectable toolkit, anything that is not available requires waiting for an update “for the entire engine.”

This ranges from silly to downright wrong.

Unity would eventually backtrack on this, but the damage to its reputation was done. Rather than deal with the idiosyncrasies of Unreal on both development and business terms, many developers decided to give Godot a chance instead. GDScript may be more obtuse, and the libraries are smaller, but at least you won’t get thrown under the bus when some exec wants to buy a new Lambo.

Weird dunk on GDScript by article authors, not to mention you can use C# or C++ (or even more) if you insist.

What really got me, though, is that not a single screenshot in the article is from the engine in question - one is from Godot and the other is from Unity. Complete nothingburger.

If you want an underdog engine to root for there’s Bevy. No need for corporate crap no matter its country of origin, doubly so if its killer feature is a passing trend.

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Came out of nowhere, saying it would compete with Godot Engine :joy:

The Immense Engine website: http://localhost:1024/website/index.html

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Sorry, but… maybe read the article?

While this is certainly true, especially in Unreal Engine and Unity, the interview (available here, in Dutch) seems to ignore the existence of Godot.

They said some silly things, but this was one they explicitly did not.

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@dragonforge-dev ,I trusted your title man!

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Y’know, if @dragonforge-dev hadn’t posted this and instead a new user did, we’d all tear them a new one.

Just an observation.

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I admit it was click-baity. I posted it at like 6am when I read it. Apologies.

You know I love a good, lively discussion, so always feel free to try and give me a hard time. :smiley:

Maybe it’s just revenge for the joke your discord tried to play. :wink: (It wasn’t, but…)

Why did you post a link to your localhost? Was this a joke I missed?

Agreed. That was a baseless value judgment with no details to hold it up.


Ultimately I just wanted to make people aware of it. And I was curious if anyone had better luck digging up more info about it. I’m kinda curious if this is like a Dutch LLM Agent bluffing the humanz.

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No problem lol.

LOL, how did you missed it? It is a joke :joy:

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A little out of topic, but if this is a reference to my wonderful chat machine, I will be very happy.

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It is.

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Apparently brussee is the co-founder of guerilla games. I don’t know, but slapping “AI” onto anything may still give a desperate C[whatever-letter-goes-here]O some of the remaining few dollars of venture capital?

no way “AI” will help bring creativity back to game development (it’s not gone, I think, it’s just that so much great stuff has already been made and is still being made in the indie-arena… my son almost exclusively plays indies, or watches those being played on yt)…

oh and the weather in Holland is atypically cold… I suspect melting ice-cap on the north wind. :wink:
(sorry for being late to the party again… did I raise a zombie thread again? :smiley: )

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so glad I clowned on that guy : )

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No, I very much doubt it. This same question has been posed many times over the past few decades, based on various ways people have tried to avoid coding. LLM use for coding has so many problems, it isn’t showing signs of replacing the need for people to code things themselves. LLM use isn’t even going to be affordable enough to be useful. Users are already starting to face the real monetary costs of using LLM tokens without venture funding money, and the costs are so prohibitive, it’s cheaper to cut back on LLM usage and to hire some more human programmers instead. And as a bonus, you don’t end up with so much unnecessary code that’s too voluminous to review and too inscrutable to maintain.

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Maybe.

So yesterday I helped my brother setup an OpenClaw agent to help him job hunt. He’s been looking for a while, and it’s demoralizing. So I recommended he do that, which of course, turned into me sitting with him. And I used Claude to tell me how to do it. Claude was wrong about multiple steps, but it was still faster to feed it an error and find a solution.

As we were doing it, he and I were talking about how much harder it would have been without me, but in the end, I think it was mostly about motivation. The LLM, despite wrong roads, got us there. And now it is going to look for and apply to up to 10 jobs a day for him. And I realized that any non-computer person with enough desire and stick-to-it-iveness could accomplish the same thing.

So while I agree that for mission-critical software, human programmers will still be used - the blow up of software engineering as a profession was because of the rise of the Internet, and every company of every type needing to be on the web. But WYSIWYG editors like Squarespace and Wix have made huge inroads for small businesses.

think that LLMs are going to make those inroads for apps, webpages, etc soon. And I think it’s going to be “affordable” because companies like Squarespace and Wix are going to figure out how to ameliorate the costs and offer a cheap enough package that it makes sense for businesses to keep using them. Because those customers are already ok with “good enough”. As long as it works - they don’t have some perfect vision about what it’s supposed to look like. The car is shiny, and it drives.

And the thing is, yes, LLMs are expensive, but at scale, they are more affordable than a human being. Take a developer that makes 150k/year. They actually cost about 240k/year with benefits. Plus lots of intangibles, like having office space for them, supplying hardware, paying HR and accounting to handle them. The list goes on.

Now look at cloud computing. AWS contributes anywhere from 50-70% of Amazon’s operating profit. In numbers that’s $10B to $15B a year. They offer cheap web hosting on demand. You get charged for what you use. Amazon pays for the IT engineers, rack space, redundancy, deals with keeping hardware up to date, electricity costs, infrastructure, etc. People using it just pay fractions of pennies per minute of usage.

That is the future that all the big companies are betting on for LLMs. They invest and then over time, people using it makes up the investment - and they have control of a piece of the market. Like the DotCom Bubble burst, I expect at some point, some companies will lose their shirts. But not all of them.

Right now, we are in the “first taste is free” phase of LLMs. But once it’s ubiquitous enough, people will need to use it to stay competitive. Then we take that 240K income and that’s 12k/month to spend on LLM tokens. And if a company needs to ratchet that cost down, they can. No firing/layoffs necessary, and they can change their mind next month without having to hire someone.

Sure, they won’t get the same output quality they would from a human. But if they can get a level of good-enough consistency then it’s worth it. And that’s the danger - the danger of scale combined with the danger of average being good enough.

As for inscrutable code, if the LLM is the only one that has to deal with it, it doesn’t matter. And the only people who will pay for it are the people who will pay through the nose for those of us who are skilled enough to fix those problems. But we will be highly-paid, bespoke troubleshooters. And the field will become much smaller. Those people becoming unemployed from software now will end up reskilling - most likely into labor jobs that LLMs aren’t good enough to do.

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There’s just one tiny detail that didn’t show up in your tarot cards. The tectonic worldwide consequences of “ai” financial bubble crash. It may end up quite nasty, affecting large parts of world population in hard to predict ways.

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Very true. I talked about it in other threads where we were discussing the LLM Bubble crash. TBH, whether it crashes or not we are already seeing the economic impacts.

Hopefully it goes the other way and people realise that human beings actually need to do something with their lives.

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